Access Key - NFT. Álvaro Daza

Access Key - NFT. Álvaro Daza

Participants:

• Nadja Bester (CEO & Co-founder of AdLunam)

• Alvaro Daza(Entrepreneur & Founder Circolo.life)

00:26

Nadja

You. Hey web3 world. This is Nadja Bester from AdLunam, and you are listening to the Future of NFTs, the show that looks beyond current NFT use cases and dives into what Non Fungible Token technology is evolving into. All this as seen through the eyes and built by the fascinating minds of the amazing guest speakers that we speak to each week. AdLunam is building the industry's first Engage to Earn IDO Launchpad with a Proof of Attention allocation mechanism. Our investor profiles use dynamic NFTs that allows allocation fractionalization. That's a whole mouthful, but let's leave it at that for now because we want to hear what Alvaro has to say today. So we are especially passionate about the future possibilities that NFTs have to offer now. Super cool, because today is our 20th episode. I don't know why we don't measure things in sevens or 14s, but 20 seems like a cool number.

01:24

Nadja

So if you've been joining in every week, super happy to have you here with us. And a reminder that we are not only live on Twitter Spaces, we are also on podcast on every platform that you can think of, whether Spotify or I don't really know the others because I use Spotify. But tune into us even if you miss some of the earlier episodes or any of the episodes, because the conversations happening here on a weekly basis, really awesome. People are doing amazing things in this space and it's always just very important to listen to minds in this industry because we are the ones shaping the industry. So catch Future of NFTs every Tuesday at this time, as well as our sister show Diving into Crypto live every Thursday at the same time. Now onto today. As I said earlier, I am extremely excited, why this is the case, because today's topic is something that I have not heard a lot of people talk about.

02:28

Nadja

So Alvaro Daza, I hope I'm pronouncing it correctly, is an entrepreneur and also the founder of Circolo.life. I'm so happy we will be talking about this today because Circolo.life brings together very key conversations that are happening in the world right now. So as a decentralized community that integrates a B and B solution for travelers using NFTs and a concierge service for remote workers via a membership. This confluence of topics remote work, NFTs and of course, the whole hospitality industry. Whether you are someone who knows this from the perspective of going around the world or within your own country and renting places or whether you are someone that rents out your property, we all know that there have been massive changes over the last few years. The Airbnb model, I'll call it, has become the mainstay of how many people travel.

03:37

Nadja

But there's also so many issues with it. And I'm speaking from personal experience, I don't have a permanent base. I live on Airbnb because I do travel from country to country all the time. And it's interesting because I don't really see many people in the web3 space taking on this area. I very well know from very hard personal experience that a lot of the Airbnb model is broken and for sure it's time for something new to come to the fore. And also as a remote worker. And there are so many people like this around the world. If you consider COVID, that has really normalized the idea of remote work. There are so many people that have unlocked the possibilities of what do they do with their lives if they are working from home, do they need to be at home or can home be anywhere?

04:31

Nadja

So these are very important topics and I'm super excited to see that NFTs are being brought into the conversation, especially in the sense of access control, which is what we will be talking about today. Now, with that introduction out the way, I want to introduce the fantastic, amazing guest that we have on. So Alvaro, I don't want toot your horn, but I know it's my job, so I'm going to leave it to you in a little bit to maybe highlight some of the most key things. But I just want to mention some really cool facts. Alvaro has traveled to over 80 countries. That's a lot. He has written two books. He's currently busy with his third book and he is passionate about things like entrepreneurship, change agents and the process of change and the meaning of change, what it means for the world and all of these different ecosystems that people are building around the world in different ways, in different formats.

05:34

Nadja

As you can tell from what he is doing by building Circolo.life. So very excited, Alvaro, to talk to you today because I think this is the kind of conversations that brings together so many of these disparate pieces. So there are so many people who are into some of these areas that you are covering. But what you are doing with circular life is really bringing together people. I think this is, at the end of the day, what it's all about, ideas and people that might not have met otherwise. So with all of that out the way, I'm going to hand it over to you. First of all, super much welcome. Second, please tell us more about you. What's your background and why did you end up here? Because from the sounds of it, you travel everywhere. So how did you end up in this particular part of your life right now, doing what you are doing?

06:33

Alvaro

Thanks so much. It's a great introduction. I'm really happy, glad to be here. And one of the main things that I would like to highlight before starting is like, well, I'm Colombian, 300% Colombian, but I'm a four mixed race guy. And this literally defines a lot of what my life's been like. Two of my grandparents are like, from Morocco and Italy. Two of my grandparents are from Congo and Colombia. And then I was born in Colombia, and with a super mix, let's say a super mixed way of growing up. Like super mixed up. Bingham I started between Colombia, Venezuela when I was in high school. Then my mom is a single mom, is a fashion designer, my dad is a musician. And I always tell this story because everything starts from there, right? Due to the war in Colombia, when my grandma was younger, she had to leave her house when she was still nine years old.

07:35

Alvaro

And she had to sell pork on the street. But thanks to her ambition and to many other factors, she ended up becoming a businesswoman. She learned by herself, like how to write, how to do math, how to do everything. And this is the story of many Colombians and many Latin Americans, right? Like that story of people building possibilities out of magical realism. And that's the kind of upbringing that I had in my life. Then I involved in the co-creation of the Colombian Entrepreneurship and Innovation Alliance, to then participating in the first creation of the first public policy for youth in Latin America. And eventually the first nomad visa for people in Latin America to then travel in the world because of I wanted to discover what people were doing, what like who was doing what around the world. And I started with Latin America.

08:30

Alvaro

days travel. I wanted to meet: 2000

09:25

Alvaro

lly being born and how in the: 2008

10:28

Alvaro

We have a lot of people contributing and creating value and adding value but we have no safe space anymore. That safety space that we don't have, it's not only tied or connected with the places where we stay, but also the way how we interact, the way how we connect and the way how we put together the best of all of us in order to create a community that can be bullshit proof. And this community is basically or this whole idea is what basically is behind Circolo.life. The idea of building a community of people who are like minded, who can contribute at the same time that they live the life of a citizen of today and goes beyond having places to stay around the world that you access using blockchain technology. But also it's tied to the idea of thinking about new ways of understanding and making statements about the way how we should work in the future, the way how we should live and connect with the people who love in the future and the way cities like in the future, right?

11:24

Alvaro

Like the whole creating a team tank that is providing initially a solution for places to stay that is circular but then it's adding up another, let's say layers to the ecosystem. Right now we are finishing up details for a dropping also carbon credits to people who are traveling. So just we compensate the carbon footprint and then we are adding only layers like memberships in wellness centers around the world, like dropping, like charity points that can help people with businesses with purpose. Also let's say that monetize their businesses at the same time that they are making impact in different parts like that. Why don't we create a community that connects community instead, communities instead of a community that just competes with other communities? That's the whole idea of what we are doing. To summarize it, what broke me here, let's say that idea of believing that people from the south are called this generation to change the narrative that for so long has been written about us.

12:25

Alvaro

It's been written about us that people from the south has that power to actually understand and contribute to the future of the world from the perspective of diversity, from the perspective of integration, of flexibility, of mindset in that remote workers, specifically Digital Nomads are not only backpackers, but also people with serious businesses and people who are actually interacting in different segments of industry and who can or might have one of the solutions to that, let's say, social isolation problem that we are experiencing into that environmental impact problem that we are, of course, facing right now. Circolo.life is in essence, as you were explaining, a membership that you buy via an NFT is a dynamic NFT, by the way, same as what you were mentioning. This dynamic NFT allows you to keep your tier as long as you pay monthly your membership. And in the moment that you don't pay, it lowers you to the lowest membership that is basically access to only the chat.

13:23

Alvaro

But in the moment that you are adding points or traveling, we give you limited or unlimited access to new tiers or to new dynamics within the ecosystem. And then this NFT is tied to a call wallet or to a noncustodial wallet that stores your NFT. That is from circular that has a private key or a private code. With that code, using NFT technology, we can open the doors of apartments. It doesn't matter where you are, whenever, wherever. And it also has the possibility of storing other, let's say, Airdrops that are tied to memberships in another different type of spaces or different types of privileges that you can experience as you travel. The whole aim is to be that one stop solution, not only for Digital Nomads, but for the citizen of today, including Digital Nomads, entrepreneurs, solopreneurs cryptopreneurs, content creators, people who work for corporates and have to travel all the time and who don't have time to do all the soft landing process.

14:17

Alvaro

And most important, for humans who believe that the future of the war is circular and is not anymore being isolated.

14:26

Nadja

Absolutely brilliant. Wow, that was a mouthful. And I mean, everything that you said, I think, is so the finger on the pulse of the zeitgeist of what is happening. If you are someone who travels like I am as well, you see this every single day. As you move from country to country, you see all of these things happening and you see how much of it is happening in isolation. People in every country around the world are working on solutions, but that connectivity is often not there because people don't know what people in other parts of the world are doing. And this idea that you said community, that connects community, I think that's incredibly powerful because this is, of course already what the entire web3 industry is doing on so many different levels. And talking about the Global South. As a South African, I see this as well.

15:20

Nadja

All of the conversations, I mean, at all times are happening in the Global North. But there is so much that can be gained from countries that historically have not been part of the narrative. Not in a leading perspective in any case, not part of the narrative as someone shaping the narrative, but someone that the narrative is being shaped for. So I think everything that you mentioned is so on point with the undercurrent of change that is happening at the moment. We have this the story that you see on the media, the other generations and how they, the older generations, let's say, and the way that they've created the world and shaped the world and would like the world to continue business as usual. But of course, with each new generation, things are fundamentally changing and cannot be changed back to the way things were. And what we are seeing right now is just this seismic shift not going to end.

16:24

Nadja

Now I'm super curious why NFTs? how did you get into NFTs? Why did you decide that for everything that you are building that NFTs would be the perfect vehicle? And I just want to mention at this point that it is. Now, I didn't know this was a thing, but I've just put it on my bucket list that I need to open apartment doors with NFTs before I die. So please build soon because I need to check that off. So tell me about your NFT journey.

16:54

Alvaro

Okay, well, as I explained before, both of my parents are Arches and there's been always the copyright aspect of it's, the copyright mixed with that business wise perspective from another side of my family. And then as I was growing up in Stern architecture, I learned how valuable is to actually be able to prove the ownership of something. But the truth is that contracts are I mean, we all know that, right? That's why we are in this space. Allow me to say that contracts in the way how we know them are obsolete and it's because they define a relationship between two people, but they don't define the value that two people are adding to each other. And this is basically why NFTs come to the space. From my perspective, NFTs are more than like digital art, which is super cool. Having collectibles that are unique and that are rare and that you can like and that you can have as a proof of authenticity of something.

17:57

Alvaro

Even having things that become reality, like objects and wearables and so on, is cool. But I believe that NFTs are the way how you can set up a common language between humans without having a friction between humans. Being able to work and operate in a frictionless system that is a trustless system at the same time that is blockchain with something that automatically defines the way how we interact and add value to each other is wonderful. And this is why I decided to have an NFT. Now essentially, for me, the difference between having an NFT and a token is that at the end of the day, the token like the tokens are cool, but they kind of perpetuate that idea that we need to accumulate in order to better or more. The NFTs bring the conversation to another level because here essentially, you are the same.

18:46

Alvaro

And the reason why you are part of that tier is because you share the same values or the same needs. And that allows you to have a conversation on another level because he's not anymore who has more, but now who adds more value and who connects better right across the ecosystem. And finally, the thing that I would like to say regarding like for example, in my case why a solution is an NFT is because then to define that relationships if we have memberships in clubs and so on and so memberships are normally something that separates us are normally something that are not easy to access to where you need to, of course have a KYC that is defined many of the times by where you come from and who you are and how you look. But in the case of the NFTs, you are coming to a space in which everybody's equal and the only thing that matters is what you share in common with people.

19:39

Alvaro

And this is what fascinates me more about it. That's why I decided to go for NFTs. It's a way of using NFTs as a contract and NFTs as a membership that then can be automatically updated as people are using or unusing or using it in a good way or for something different. And that's magic. And that magic is what I want to have in the project.

20:04

Nadja

Alvaro, I have to say, I speak to people all the time about NFTs and what they are. And I really just want to highlight your definition and what it means to you, this common language between people, between humans in this frictionless trustless system, because of the technology that it is. Because this really highlights that. At the end of the day, it is all about the technology and the possibilities that people build on top of that technology. This idea that some people are using NFTs for accumulation, that's fantastic. That's an avenue that many people want to go into. But as you say, that's not what NFTs is because NFTs at the end of the day is a technology and everything else that's built on top of the technology, the applications that comes from people's imaginations, from their values that are driving them, whatever it is that they want to build in the world.

21:00

Nadja

So I think that's a beautiful way of describing the technology as truly agnostic from the ideas built on top of it. It is NFTs are a possibility as a technology and what you do with it is up to you. So I want to talk a little bit more about Circolo.life. Tell us where you are in the process, what's happening at the moment, what the roadmap is, when can we expect this to be on the shelf and ready for takeoff?

21:33

Alvaro

Okay, this is an amazing part. So we've been in this journey for over four years. As I explained before, one good advantage of what I decided to do is not only traveling, but also testing different potential scenarios in which this could operate and work. And I tested particular individually, like each of the models or each of the ways how this could create community. So we tested events, we had more than 10,000 attendees in one year doing partnerships with Embassies and entrepreneurs and corporations and so on, mainly in Kenya, Turkey, and Colombia. We've also tested the peer to peer change, let's say like entrepreneurs also of the ecosystem, exchanging their services within the community, selling to each other. We also have great results there. And then we tested apartments. So we set up some apartments in Kenya, Turkey, Spain, Colombia, Mexico, and Dubai. And we just tested the way, how each of the cultures interact with the same component, with the same results.

22:35

Alvaro

Then sorry, with the same technology. Then this year, last year, in October, we started developing the hardware that is a bracelet, a beautiful bracelet that you will start to see soon. And this hardware had too many shapes. At the beginning it was a card, then it was in the cell phone. Then we say, no, it needs to be a bracelet. And the reason why it needs to be a bracelet is because in the end, the circle represents that connection in that community. But also, what's powerful is that the same bracelet can be worn by anybody. I don't need to have a certain kind of status. It doesn't matter who you are. It comes down to what you share. And this is why we decided to go for bracelets. Plus the fact that it's very beautiful wearable that can be actually worn by people from each, let's say, wrist size.

23:27

Alvaro

And then lastly, what we started doing was building partnerships. In this moment, we have in place partnerships with more than 520 apartments in several countries. And we also have some partnerships ongoing with On Top. That is the first compliance service in the world, present in more than 150 countries. One of the things that we wanted to do is we didn't want it to blush the property owners to necessarily onboard us on Blockchain because they don't need to understand it, but they can share the same values. So what we did was basically partner with On Top. We receive us, we received our payments in crypto, and they give a card to each of the property owners. So the property owners can actually withdraw the money using a circle of car. And same for other people, the entrepreneurs or the nomad travelers. They also get access to the Invoicing suite that gives you not only the access to the apartments, but also to some other nice perks.

24:17

Alvaro

Like, for example, a travel insurance, like, for example, the tree planting that I just mentioned before and other nice utilities that are giving you attention in the case that you have an emergency or an accident or these type of things. And access to some workplaces or coffee shops around the world. We are working on another partnerships and this place that we are right now at, it finishes in two weeks. We are finishing a fundraising precedent is a private fundraising. We initially we did it in and after we finished this we are going to launch in February 28. We are going to host our first official community event in Colombia. Every month we are going to host a different official community event in a different country. We are going to travel to all the countries next year and at the end of last year of next year in November, we are going to host a first Humans Con.

25:19

Alvaro

That is basically that conference for, let's say the community of the communities, people from different environments and different backgrounds, connecting and working together to build a future that's in the roadmap for the implementation. We are going to have it live in February. After that, what's going to happen is we're mainly going to focus on growing in terms of course, presence around the world, growing in terms of service around the world, and growing in terms of partnerships, making sure that we offer not only apartments and insurance and these things, but also, as I explain, wellness services, access to parties, access to places. In the end of the day, we don't need to have prejudices about what you use the bracelet for, but we can be intentional about how we give you tools to connect with people in as many as you can. So then you, let's say, explode your talent and be as good as you can by using the power of connecting with others.

26:14

Alvaro

the community. And lastly, in: 2025

26:53

Nadja

Sounds like there's super many very exciting things up ahead. But I would like to focus on the fact that some of our team members are in Colombia and we actually have a lot of team members all over South America and different countries. So if they are here and listening, they should definitely connect with you and attend your event on the 28th of Feb. Definitely. There's so many exciting things up ahead. But I want to focus a little bit on this integration between because obviously we know that let's call it the Airbnb model because that's obviously what people are used to. So there's this whole ecosystem out there of people opening their homes and allowing others travelers to come into their homes and stay there for a while. So how do you see the future of not only with Circolo.life but in general, do you think that people are going to move from this web2 model that we have where of course we know that platforms like Airbnb takes huge fees and very centralized?

28:00

Nadja

Do you envision a future where we are going to move towards this web3 vision that you guys are already building and working on. Where we are going to see the human to human connection aided by trustless technology. That is decentralized rather than these monopolizing platforms that take a huge cut out of every transaction that stayer and the person offering is connecting about.

28:29

Alvaro

Yeah, definitely. I think that, for example, as it works in our minds, what we believe is that the reason why we are creating this is because at the end of the day today's generation and I'm talking not only about the gen Z and the millennials and others. But people who are living this time in history, they are aware that the way forward is connecting, engaging and sharing. That's the way to go. That way to go means that in the future we should be able to make sure that everybody gets an important part as they participate in the ecosystem. So if you're a builder or if you're a host or if you are a guest in the ecosystem, you should be able to share the same profit that the ecosystem is generating in different ways. And what we believe is that definitely, for example, how this is different to the traditional model is that instead of taking huge fees from this, I assure the owner or the property owner a fixed amount of money that they are getting always.

29:32

Alvaro

So I don't take cuts that are larger or shorter according to what's convenient for me, but the system helps them generate money from what they are doing. If they want to, for example, create a property pool that is like, let's say not the contrary, but it's like a similar part of the model to the liquidity pool, but in this case, a property pool. If they want to take place in a property pool, they can actually be part of that and then share the incomes that properties that are listed in the ecosystem that they're paying for another, let's say, membership fee that is only for property owners. They can definitely just share it. And finally, for the small property owners, the one that are not developers and that don't have a huge amount of properties listed in the ecosystem, the whole thing about sharing like allows them not only to.

30:20

Alvaro

Share the property and to get, let's say, money and rewards for it, but also to be able to use the properties across the world so they can do, let's say, cool sharing of properties as they are exchanging the stays that they are offering, either for trips or also for money, depending on what they want.

30:42

Nadja

Yeah, absolutely agreed with you. I'm wondering whether I'm a host or whether I'm a guest or whether I'm a developer and any of these partners in this whole ecosystem that we are talking about. What is needed? Because, of course, at the moment, what you are initially focusing on are people who are already more attuned to this kind of thinking. But what do you think is needed for the mass adoption to move from the model that we are currently using to this new way of thinking? Because it does require a shift in perspective in thinking. So if we are obviously not going to align everyone in the same way, to think the same way, how quickly do you see people going from the traditional existing model over into this new way of thinking?

31:39

Alvaro

Well, I must say that my perspective is that actually the Scalability or the Sponge or the, let's say the adoption of this in the traditional market will not really take long. And my statement for saying that is this most of people today are paying rents. These rents we all know are going higher and higher. They come with different conditions. If people travel to a place, if people are working in a place, they still need to do compliance and they still need to do, let's say, some clearance in order, like to be allocated in an apartment or to be granted a contract, a renting contract. Especially with corporations, when they have workers or travelers who are actually allocated in different places, whether they pay or not for the rent, they still need to give certificates and so on in order to be able to generate the contracts for the people.

32:32

Alvaro

Here you sign one contract and with that one contract, your employees, whether you're paying or not, have access to apartments around the world. Here you sign one contract and that contract that you are signed, that membership that you are paying for means that you don't need to pay extra costs for rent. This replaces your rent. So if you're in the same city where you live, you can stay there for three months, and then you decide to travel 20 days to Istanbul. You go to Istanbul for 20 days and then you go ten days to Rome. You stay in Rome for ten days and then you come back to Cape Town or go to Dubai. It doesn't matter. You still pay the same rent. So essentially we are proposing to replace that whole idea of paying rent plus fees for travel. Now, what's going to happen is that definitely the hospitality industry and the way how hospitality works is going to change and in fact, it's already shifting.

33:24

Alvaro

According to data, 82% of people already use subscription based models. Call it Netflix, call it and other software solutions that we use and other kind of things. All these people that are using subscription based models are basically people who are still in Web2. The subscription based economy has grown in the past eight years over 240 times and today is a market that represents $200 billion. That subscription based economy is the same economy that we are tapping to. But the difference is that we are not only offering a subscription, but we are also offering a solution that represents for people not only like saving money in expenses, but also connecting in a different way with their environment and with their family. Let's say that my challenge, mainly in the terms of adoption, will not come necessarily from giving people a solution that is easy to understand, but will come from the way how I communicate the story.

34:24

Alvaro

And this is a thing that I believe that we must all maybe reflect on within the blockchain space. And is that the way how we talk with all the jargon and with all the complicated terms is not contributing to the adoption of people, let's say, that are working every day on the streets or the shift from people like to the Web3 economy. So the first thing that I need to do in my case is to make sure that every communication I do is happening and is connecting with people from the emotional side. And people are buying me not because of his Web3, but even if it's Web3, people are buying because if I'm offering a solution and because of I'm creating something that is for them. And funny enough, I have already 152 people in the waiting list for the membership and I would say that around 80% of these people are coming from the Web2 world.

35:19

Alvaro

They don't have any tied to blockchain or they don't work in Web3. They don't do things, but they understand the subscription and for them makes sense to pay only one month fee. And with that being sorted because at the end of the day, it's not only about saving money, but having perks and having access to a community.

35:38

Nadja

So I love numbers, I want to be on the waiting list too, but I want to be number 155. So let a few people sign up for me so I can find that I'm fine with you. As I said earlier, this is something that I face on a daily basis. I mean, this is a daily reality to me, all of these things that you are talking about. So I can definitely see as someone who uses this for these purposes, how this would be, but also agree with you that people, if we are addressing things only from the Web3 jargon perspective, people don't always understand that the solutions that are being built for them. And Reddit, I mean, such a classic case study, I think for years to come. In future, students are going to learn about this at university, about the Reddit launch of NFTs without calling it NFTs because we saw the adoption that takes place when people don't need to use the jargon of the technology to be able to use the technology.

36:42

Nadja

Now I want to ask, I see we are kind of coming towards the end and I see there's a whole lot of questions from the audience. The audience please, if you have a question, I forgot to mention this at the beginning. Do DM your question to the AdLunam twitter handle or you can also of course put in a speaker request and we'll get you up on stage. So this community, obviously the core community of Circolo.life needs to be the one that's going to kick things off to begin with and after that adoption can take place. So how are you going about building your community?

37:17

Alvaro

Well, that's actually one of the things that to me was essential when I decided to travel the world. I remember when I was telling you that I wanted to actually discover change makers and entrepreneurs, people who were building different types of businesses. And it was because to me, what was important from the beginning was to understand different perspectives and different ways of understanding the same reality. So I started building that community long ago, mainly on Instagram and let's say across other platforms like LinkedIn and Facebook. So far we have a community, let's say the only numbers in social media of around 25,000 people. This same community has allowed me to participate in platforms and events in the offline world that is not online that have impacted more than 100,000 people. And one of the great achievements so far of it is that thanks to that interaction with that community last year I was named as one of the five Global Entrepreneurship Ambassadors of Colombia.

38:19

Alvaro

Meaning that gives me access to partnerships with powerful institutions with the support of the Colombian government and partnerships with specific communities with the support of my country. That's so far how we are going about most of the job has been in mouth work and most of the interaction that we've been building, that we've been working on, has been based on making sure that everybody has a space and everybody has, let's say, some kind of channel to participate in the different things that we do. I would like to know if that answers the question or if there's something that you would like me to go deeper.

39:04

Nadja

We can go on from here only because of time. Otherwise I would love to go deeper into that and many other things zooming out a little bit and thinking about what the implications are of NFTs beyond just this one aspect. How do you think NFTs are going to evolve from whether this is this representation of accumulation or whether this is access control and there are all these different applications. But if were to look into the future, what do you think NFTs is going to represent in the world at large?

39:40

Alvaro

Well, what I believe is that NFTs are going to move to be used in several fields. And those fields are way beyond art and way beyond like, accumulation as a representation of status. It will go to detail certificates used for health. It will go to identification and let's say, recognition of citizenship. It will go to create, for example, ways of voting and vetting for deciding budgets in government. It will go to create solutions for agriculture, solutions for real estate, and solutions for things. It will go definitely beyond subscriptions. And that's what keeps me hopeful. I believe that NFT technology and blockchain is one of those things that I'm always hopeful, right? Like, I'm 100% dedicated to this. I don't do any other thing. This is my full time job. So this is what breaks me up every day, that hope that thanks to this technology, we can actually being able to provide solutions and really find the way, how we plan cities, how we live, how we work, and how we interact.

40:51

Nadja

Very exciting times up ahead, however long it takes. Final question before I hand it over to the audience. What is your philosophy about Web3 and all of these technologies that we are only starting to unlock today? And of course, there are many others in the future to come. What is your philosophy about these technologies changing lives?

41:14

Alvaro

Well, in my case, what I believe is that in the end, what we are creating right now is that urge of freedom of humanity. What we are experiencing right now is, let's say, only the beginning of several ways of interaction that people are redefining only because of that urge and that need. And if we look back into history, many of the things that happened actually were because of that, right? Like at the end of the day, cities were born thanks to their markets, and markets were born thanks to the commerce. Commerce was born thanks to the domestication of food that started in Persia, that started with the bread and with the discovery of the bread sorry, the wet and the oil in Gaziantep in Turkey and the border between Turkey and Syria. And that domestication of food led to the creation of the first formal cities that were actually, let's say, a copy of other settlements that existed in Mesopotamia.

42:19

Alvaro

Let's say that single thing, that single idea of a market, led to the development of spaces where people could interact and live, and only because of people were living. A technology that was called a coin was developed in Izmir, right, in Turkey. Again, that coin was the first form of interaction that will put people at the same level and then from the coin, many other things have been developed. We already know what happened right now. So the subsequent technologies that came after the invention of the coin and the invention of other artifacts and the creation of the fashion industry and the creation of the food industry and different things came because of humans needed. To understand the way how they could interact between each other and how they could find common ground and solutions for each other as were advancing and growing as humanity. We've been exactly doing the same with the difference that some people tried for so long, only for so long, to take away that power of decision.

43:18

Alvaro

And I understand that most of us or many of us will feel like hopeless about that idea of control and that idea of power. But listen, this is the time for humanity and this is the time for people to take over. And how we are taking over is thanks to Blockchain. Blockchain, unlike any other technology, is basically in a technical way, in antenna way, the possibility of using the most simple kind of interaction, that is interaction based on the idea of community together in order to create a greater and a common ground. And that common ground comes across also other technologies like artificial intelligence, machine learning, IOT, and things that are there and that eventually will be integrated and that will definitely change lives. What I would say to finalize only because this topic really passionate me, but I will say to finalize is that whatever we will see in the future might not be perfect, but it's going to be an interpretation on the time in history that we are living.

44:21

Alvaro

And that time in history will define the new ways how we are going to find our freedom eventually at some point in our lives as humans.

44:30

Nadja

Couldn't have said it better myself. Thank you so much for that beautiful answer. And I think that's such a fantastic note to end this conversation off. So going to give the audience what they want. So give me a second and I can just quickly. All right, so first one Alvaro. Okay, sorry. This is from Chris. Alvaro, you've built something wonderful. Do you think an Airbnb will want to compete or buy you out? What would you do? So, big question so we can recognize.

45:00

Alvaro

Thank you so much, Chris. And the short answer is that they already tried. Coincidentally, I was on an early stage, very early stage only the idea. I came to a meeting with a friend of my friend and were talking. I shared with them the idea, and it turned out that this guy was a very good friend with somebody at Airbnb. A week after I received an email asking me to send them my business model. I didn't. So they asked me to sign an NDA. I suggested a Zoom meeting. We had a meeting. I explained them, not recorded I explained them and they say, okay, how much you want for this? So I say, Well, I don't really want to sell this. I'm developing, we are finding the way. And I believe that initially, not only Airbnb, other models are going to try definitely to compete, but I believe that this is not the time for eventually they realize that my solution is not designed for competing.

46:05

Alvaro

My solution is designed actually to help them, for helping them think about what we are creating is that this is not only for us to have a system, because we don't aim to monopolize things. We aim to collaborate with everybody and to make sure that everybody in the ecosystem. Whether if you're in the hospitality in the traditional hospitality world or in the decentralized hospitality world, in the co-sharing lifestyle, you can be part of this by, let's say, tailoring different ways of understanding memberships for your community and also tying to the main community that we are creating with different ecosystems. This is basically different ecosystems and communities connected to each other.

46:47

Nadja

Well, yeah, keep on staying in there and fighting the good fight because it seems like a lot of people are very interested in what you are doing. So next question. Fractional ownership is becoming more and more common. Do you see the realty industry one day using NFTs as a way to use the Rent don't own model? And this is from Japeto.

47:12

Alvaro

Hi Japeto. Well, actually three days ago I had a meeting and it was very funny. I had this meeting with somebody, let's say a week ago. We were talking, then I received, then I meet this person who I met briefly, this place. And then you say, hey, do you want to meet someone? Say, yeah. So they invited me to Burj Khalifa. We came, we had a meeting in the 123 floor and this guy was like, okay, so he's the biggest real estate developer in Spain. They have more than 50,000 properties. And they basically wanted to understand how to fractionate properties, like how to fraction properties, how to work with this model. And if we can actually partner with them for something at this stage, we can't partner with them. Really. But we talked about this thing and I noticed not only from him, but from other people, that it's actually this interest.

48:10

Alvaro

even come from now, it comes: 5000

49:17

Alvaro

And definitely this is going to be one thing that's going to happen that we must watch next year and in our ecosystem. How it works is what that property pool that I was explaining you about, that organization not only of one property but of pools of properties that will allow people, even within our community not only to be able to be a membership but also to be corners of the community.

49:40

Nadja

Yeah, lovely. I could stay on and talk to you for another 2 hours but your time unfortunately ticks on its own, of its own accord. So I'm going to end it off here Alvaro, but I think so many of the things you said obviously have resonated with so many people, not only the ones attending this call live at the moment, but all of those who will be listening to this recording afterwards. So let us know where the audience can find you, where can they follow what Circolo.life is building as well as yourself and maybe just very briefly tell us about the book that you're writing.

50:18

Alvaro

Thank you so much. Well, first of all you can find me all across social media with the same handle at Alvdaza A-L-D like V-D-A-Z-A, Alvdaza and Circolo is Circolo.life basically everywhere as well. So you can find us in that way. If you want to actually reach out you can just hit me with a DM on Instagram, on Twitter or on LinkedIn, wherever you want. I am also on Telegram with the same handle Alvdaza and if you want to connect I'm more than happy to share with you more thoughts. If you are an investor and you are listening to this, we are fundraising until the third week of December. We will of course have a talk and we see if we are aligned. If we buy together we definitely connect and we definitely grow this thing and make this happen. And about the book, in this book what I wanted touch is on the circular economy.

51:18

Alvaro

So what I decided to write the book the Circle Economics. So basically what we are going to talk about is how circular economy is going to shape the world are going to be the next. So yeah, it's going to be in January and where we are going to have a presale on Amazon as well in December, 2 week of December. So if you also want to know more, I definitely share with you links or different resources and I'll be more than happy to talk about it.

51:53

Nadja

And I think at that time, we probably need to get you on for a second installment of the show because it's really not easy to end this off after the first hour. But, Alvaro, thank you so much. It's been absolutely lovely talking to you and listening to all of the things that you are building and why you are building it so super much. Looking forward to the future. And remember, I'm 155. I will give you my name, definitely everything I need to be on the waiting list. I hope you enjoyed this hour with us, as always. Catch you again next week for another episode of The Future of NFTs, brought to you by AdLunam and Alvaro Yeah, we will be watching very closely and see what you guys are building because I think big things are coming and we should all be part of it.

52:41

Nadja

So, lots of love to everyone out there. Have the most beautiful final Tuesday in the November of this year and I'll see you next week. Cheers.

52:51

Alvaro

Thank you so much. Have a wonderful time. It's been a privilege to be here. See you guys. Bye.